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Sean Callagy’s Results Formula, Ep #178

Sean is the Chief Visionary Officer + Co-Founder at UNBLINDED, a company focused on influence, process, and self-mastery. He is a successful attorney, speaker, entrepreneur, business coach, and the owner and President of Callagy Law. In this episode of Negotiations Ninja, he shares his four-step results formula to master the power of influence and communicating effectively—to take a “no” to a “yes” in an ethical, powerful way.

Outline of This Episode

  • [2:10] Sean Callagy’s background
  • [4:01] Law schools lack negotiation education
  • [5:41] The creation of emotional rapport
  • [8:34] Pain and the yes strategy
  • [11:18] How to develop emotional states
  • [14:58] Behavioral economics and the fear of loss
  • [16:11] How to develop a congruent unique identity
  • [19:22] How to develop congruence
  • [23:12] What is agreement formation all about?
  • [25:15] How to connect with Sean Callagy

The power of influence

Sean discovered that influence is a superpower 23 years ago. He started going blind and couldn’t live out his dream career as a baseball player, so he went to law school. He didn’t necessarily care about becoming an attorney. But he was blown away to find out that influence mattered in the world. But they don’t teach you about the power of influence and negotiation in your ivy league education.

People in his law firm who were less inexperienced were experiencing more money, more freedom, and more influence over their life and other people than those who had been there much longer. Those who can influence were in the positions they wanted to be. He realized he had none of those abilities and needed to learn them and acquire them. That began his lifelong journey to become influential.

Why law schools don’t provide formal negotiation education

Sean points out that it’s an extraordinary failing that needs to be fixed. He is perplexed by what is taught in elementary school, high school, college, graduate school, medical school, and law school. He ponders, “I literally thought that law schools should be liable for fraud for accepting students and not giving them any optic on the economic dynamics of becoming an attorney.”

He thought that you become an attorney and automatically make a good living. He left school with $100,000 in debt. He had gotten “The” job out of law school. But it put him in a position where he could barely pay his rent, his car payment, and his law school loan. He firmly believes that there are major flaws in the educational system, particularly in teaching the skill of influence. So he sought to spend his career developing the skill of influence—and now he teaches it in his results formula.

The Callagy Results Formula

What does Sean’s formula look like? It’s a four-step process:

  1. Create emotional rapport: You have to move beyond surface-level rapport and create an emotional connection with strong two-way communication and value-exchange.
  2. Pain and the “yes” strategy: People make decisions because the pain of not taking the action exceeds the pain of taking the action. You have to help them find that pain point and take them to a “yes.”
  3. Develop a congruent unique identity: Your offering, who you are, what your company is—all need to be congruent and unique. Your counterpart needs to perceive you to be credible.
  4. Agreement formation: Agreement formation is about believing that what you’re proposing is best. You get there through effective questioning, leaning into objectives, and level 5 listening.

The creation of emotional rapport

The first step in Sean’s results formula begins with creating emotional rapport. Sean points out that there are three levels of rapport: surface, real, and emotional. Influence is about having an idea, communicating the idea, having it be received by somebody else, and acted upon. If you don’t have emotional rapport and listening is not open, all you sound like is Charlie Brown’s teacher.

Emotional rapport means your message must be open for receipt. There needs to be trust and belief that the communication you’re having is authentic because a connection has been established. Communication is about perspective on value exchange—not about relationships. He points out that the issue lies in the misinterpretation of value that happens without emotional rapport.

You have to believe in the authenticity of the perceived value. That comes on the heels of the establishment of emotional rapport. It’s connecting at more of a heart level than a head level. Sean emphasizes that it applies to the courtroom, to engineering, to prisons, to every conceivable dynamic.

People have developed the idea in their mind that they have to persuade someone based on the logic of their argument. But emotion plays such a large part. Everyone talks about logos but hardly anyone talks about pathos—the emotional aspect. Emotional rapport is sorely missing in so much influence teaching.

Sean takes a deep-dive into finding people’s pain and utilizing the “yes” strategy, how to develop a congruent unique identity, and how to get to agreement formation in the rest of this episode. Do not miss it!

Resources & People Mentioned

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Digitization and Transformation in Procurement with Michael van Keulen, Ep #176

Michael van Keulen (MVK) was born and raised in Amsterdam. He was at Foot Locker 15 years ago when they embraced e-sourcing with Iasta. He started in financing but fell in love with procurement. He set up the procurement function in Europe at VF Corp which caught the eye of corporate. So they asked him to lead their global transformation. He then joined Lululemon five years ago and built their procurement infrastructure from the ground up. He brought them into the modern era.

Now, MVK is the Chief Procurement Officer at Coupa Software. With over 20 years in procurement and finance—on both sides of the table—he knows the industry inside and out. In this episode of Negotiations Ninja, we take a deep dive into digital implementation, getting stakeholders on board, and the best practices to follow.

Outline of This Episode

  • [2:15] MVK’s background in procurement
  • [4:44] Similarities from the inside and outside
  • [6:45] The resistance to digitally transform
  • [9:22] The right stakeholders to get on board
  • [14:33] The questions to ask technology partners
  • [18:32] Where procurement tech is going
  • [21:30] Benchmarking data at scale
  • [28:06] Stakeholder engagement is the key to success
  • [29:19] How to connect with MVK

How are both sides of procurement similar?

MVK notes that procurement is always a methodical approach. Whether you’re working in procurement in the clothing industry or offering software to the procurement industry, it’s still a seven-step process. It starts with identifying the requirements and the needs of the baselines to set a baseline. Then you scope the market for suppliers that can satisfy those requirements.

Then you run a competitive event and go into the contracting phase. Once that has gone through the right channels, the contract is executed. You then begin to monitor the performance of that supplier. Michael has learned whether you’re in retail, technology, FMCG, Pharma, etc.—the procurement process is very similar and can be digitized. Procurement is transferable knowledge.

Why such a resistance to digital transformation?

Why do so many procurement leaders resist digital transformation? MVK points out that digitization is ready for procurement, but procurement isn’t always ready for digitization. Why? The maturity level of the profession. Some industries—like automotive—are mature from a procurement standpoint. Most other industries are still immature. The CIO and CFO have a big seat at the table compared to the CPO. As a result, it requires procurement to step up and make the business case and stand behind it in a powerful way. You have to be willing to put your career on the line.

You have to claim you’ll drive the value that you’re articulating. To do that, you need the platform and the solution. What often happens is that IT takes over the conversation. At the end of the day, IT is there to support the business; they turn it into an IT conversation, rather than a “what’s the best solution for the business,” which makes it hard for the CPO to tell that story and show the ROI.

They used to say, “Well, I got an ERP, so I’ll run some analytics on that and then use taxonomy to classify taxonomy,” etc., and you become rearview mirror procurement instead of forward-facing procurement. The key is that it’s about the positioning of procurement and the ability to properly articulate what the value is that digitization brings to the table.

Get the right stakeholders to get on board

MVK emphasizes the need to create partnerships in your organization. There are many different stakeholders in the process. Who do you need to connect with? The first one is finance. If you’re going to automate AP, it has large downstream ramifications in the procurement to pay process. Whether it’s paper-based or a scanning engine, AP says they have automated their downstream. So why are you digitizing it?

The second group to build a strong partnership with is IT. You need forward-thinking IT leaders. You have to get them behind the digitization journey. You need to clearly articulate why it’s so important for the organization. The third group is legal. There is contract life-cycle management in your digitization journey. The bottom line? Whatever platform you choose, you need to run a proper process.

Ultimately, the business itself needs to adopt digitization. If no one adopts it, your ROI will go down the tube. Companies think if the end-user adopts the technology, they’ll be fine. But to do business, the supplier needs to adopt it as well. It needs to be intuitive. Get your users in front of the platforms you’re choosing between. Then you need to think about your suppliers. Will they accept whatever you decide to implement? If they don’t, people will look for ways to go around the system.

If everyone is on board, you’ll get support for your story, and the change management will be easier.

Stakeholder engagement is the key to success

MVK cannot stress it enough. It will get sensitive and contentious. People will challenge you. Don’t be afraid to step up. “There has never been a better time to be in procurement. There has never been a better time to do what we do. We are uniquely qualified and uniquely positioned to drive our companies forward. Digitization is a part of that. But we have to elevate our profession.” It is procurement’s time to lead. It always starts with a partnership.

What questions should you ask technology partners during implementation? How do you get your company and stakeholders to embrace AI? How about benchmarking good data and how it can be a game-changer for your organization? Listen to the full conversation for the full benefit of MVK’s expertise.

Resources & People Mentioned

Connect with Michael van Keulen

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How to Get Your Anger Under Control in a Negotiation per Svitlana Kalitsun, Ep #175

It’s become fairly evident that emotions play a large part in negotiations. Being able to manage your emotions is one of the most important parts of a negotiation. When things go sideways, frustration builds, and tempers flare, what do you do? How do you keep your emotions from spinning out of control?

Svitlana Kalitsun realized through her career as a lawyer that negotiation techniques aren’t taught—but they’re expected of lawyers. So she sought out negotiation training and found her calling. Now, Svitlanais a trainer at the Negotiation Academy, based in Vienna, Austria. She has 10+ years of experience working in leading law firms and large corporations. Svitlana is one of the leading women in the world at what she does.

Outline of This Episode

  • [2:30] Svitlana Kalitsun’s background in negotiation
  • [4:57] Why we counter emotion with emotion
  • [6:52] How to counteract an angry response
  • [11:41] How to deal with a counterparts emotion
  • [17:11] What happens after you’ve cooled down?
  • [18:24] Why “I feel” versus “you are”
  • [22:00] Emotion is a distraction from the negotiation
  • [22:52] How to connect with Svitlana Kalitsun

Why we counter emotion with emotion

As soon as we see someone being emotional, we respond with a very basic biological reaction: anger. Humans deal with isopraxism—the body’s natural response to mirror someone else’s body language or behavior. It creates a cycle of anger.

Svitlana points out that most negotiators aren’t properly trained on how to handle their emotions. We’ve evolved into creatures ready to fight with the slightest provocation. The more ancient part of our brains kicks in to work against us. It’s almost like we have to fight against our natural evolution to control ourselves. It’s difficult. Svitlana adds that we often express our anger in the moment and end up regretting it. So what do you do?

What to do when you feel angry

We don’t want to say something that we would regret that could potentially ruin the negotiation. So what should you do? Svitlana notes that there are two categories of anger: Your anger, and your counterparty’s anger.

If you feel angry, the best thing to do is recognize what you’re feeling. Ask yourself: How are you feeling? What are you feeling? Most people often feel threatened, like something is in danger. Are you protecting yourself against something? Recognize the emotion and control it. If you’re angry, it’s not a safe way to negotiate.

Don’t label yourself “I am angry”. Doing so makes you further embody the anger. But if you label what you’re feeling—“I am feeling angry”—you’re able to create a dissociation from the feeling itself to deal with that emotion. Labeling the emotion helps you dissociate from it and look at it objectively.

Bring emotional intelligence to the table

We are all people. We all have emotions, moods, and bad days. Just to know how you feel is a superpower. Svitlana emphasizes that everyone needs to bring emotional intelligence to the negotiation table. As long as you know how you feel and know yourself, you are able to bring results. It’s all about yourself and you CAN influence yourself.

The goal must always be to break the cycle of escalation. You don’t want to escalate the anger within the room. It’s challenging to deal with it. That’s why it’s so important to control your emotions—because it’s so easy to lose control. How do you deal with a counterpart’s anger? How do you ask the right questions to move the negotiation forward? Listen to the whole episode to learn more!

Connect with Svitlana Kalitsun

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Throwback Thursday with Marty Park, Ep #174

How do you negotiate like an entrepreneur? Marty Park—my business coach and entrepreneur extraordinaire—has built 14 companies over two decades. You don’t build that many businesses from the ground up without being an expert negotiator. So in this special Throwback Thursday episode, we take a look back at episode #117. Marty shares what he thinks is often overlooked in negotiation. He shares an example of a failed negotiation—as well as his favorite negotiation (HINT: It included free beer). He also shares how to leverage Logos, Pathos, and Ethos. Don’t miss this episode!

Negotiate Like an Entrepreneur, with Marty Park, Ep #117

 

Trade Negotiations between the United Arab Emirates and Israel with Dr. Shira Mor, Ep #173

What is happening between Israel and the United Arab Emirates? Is the U.S. part of the negotiations? What has led to the trade deals that are being formalized? This is a massive and historically relevant deal that’s been overshadowed by the coronavirus. Dr. Shira Mor shares a boots on the ground perspective of what’s happening in Tel Aviv. Get the inside scoop on the trade negotiations in this episode of Negotiations Ninja.

Dr. Shira Mor is an Israeli-American who graduated from the Columbia Business School in 2013 with a Ph.D. in Management. She has worked with executives and start-ups to obtain funding. She negotiated with a European central bank in 2014. She is an organizational consultant, lecturer, content writing specialist, and an expert in multi-cultural negotiations. She brings unique expertise and perspective to this episode. Don’t miss it!

NOTE: The United Arab Emirates will be referred to as UAE, Emirates, and the Union throughout the episode.

Outline of This Episode

  • [1:52] Dr. Shira Moor’s background in negotiation
  • [4:27] Why is this trade deal monumental?
  • [6:39] How did the first deal happen
  • [8:10] Capitalism breaks down barriers
  • [9:45] The cultural similarities between the nations
  • [12:30] North American negotiations with the Emirates
  • [18:17] The key differences to overcome
  • [20:40] What can the formalized process be attributed to
  • [22:26] What’s the next thing on the horizon
  • [25:42] How to develop relationships with people in the UAE
  • [28:51] How to connect with Dr. Shira Mor

The monumental trade deal that should be taking the world by storm

Historically, Israel has faced a lot of political challenges. It’s surrounded by countries that it doesn’t have peace relations with. So any form of trade relations with the Arab world is ground-breaking. It’s expanding the opportunities for business exchange in the region. Unfortunately, it’s been overshadowed by the coronavirus pandemic. Most people have seen very little news coverage of this groundbreaking trade negotiation.

In October of 2019, Shira flew to Abu Dhabi using her American passport. It was a scary journey. The nature of the relationship was not formalized or clear. She didn’t know if it was safe for her to be there. One year ago—as a Jewish person—she would never have been able to talk about being there.

The formalization of trade deals is a huge hallmark for recognizing the state of Israel as a state. It is a bold move in terms of what the Emirates is doing right now. Historically speaking, this shouldn’t have happened—but it is. So what brought about this shift towards amicable trade?

What led to the first trade agreement

Shira points out that there has been a prolific Jewish population in the Emirates for years who, for obvious reasons, have kept a low-profile. It’s the informal business negotiations happening in the background that Shira believes eventually led to Israel and the Emirate representative to begin negotiations.

The UAE wants to connect with and be on par with all technological developments of the Western world. Israel brings a lot of technological advances to the table. One of the first deals that was struck had to do with the Weizmann Institute, a leading cancer research organization. These deals are meant to facilitate knowledge exchange and technology development for the United Arab Emirates and Israel.

While trade deals are slowly developing, it is a strong step toward peace that has been sought after for generations.

The ability of capitalism to break down barriers

If you want your citizens to become wealthy, you have to break down barriers and start to play nice. Dubai is a tech-forward city. Israel has been a start-up leader for years. They’re progressing quickly. Naturally, geographically speaking, it makes sense to work with your closest neighbor and foster partnerships and relationships.

Shira points out that there was a lot of business happening between Israel and the Emirates before the formalized peace, but it was kept hush-hush. It’s like someone formalizing their engagement by getting married. They decided to formalize their relationship, and now it’s public for the world to see.

What are the cultural similarities between the nations? What are the differences? How should a North American come to Middle Eastern negotiations?

What can the formalized process be attributed to

Shira doesn’t believe that the formalized trade deals can be attributed to any one person. It was definitely a grass-roots movement from the ground up. There haven’t been political dealings on a formal level that she knows of. News sources are highlighting the business transactions that are moving forward. From Shira’s understanding, businesses have led this to be formalized. She cannot say that she heard about anything from a political side. How ironic that many nations have been pushing for peace in Israel, yet it’s business people from within the nations themselves that are finally making it happen.

What’s the next thing on the horizon

Firstly, Israeli startups are funded by American Hedge Funds. The US will benefit from these transactions—thus becoming a third-party adjunct to this agreement. Entrepreneurs are looking for investors, and the U.S. is a source of capital. But just like China entered the North American market, what will be the impact? What are the guidelines for religious issues or cultural issues? Companies have different perspectives, so it will be interesting to follow.

No one ever imagined this could actually happen. There’s a lot of potential. But Shira says to slowly create relationships and be cautious. She hopes that this will be a new path to peace. It doesn’t make sense to be at war with the people you’re trading with.

How do you develop relationships with business counterparts in Arab countries? What could the negotiation process look like? Dr. Shira Mor shares some amazing advice and strategies in this episode. Make sure you listen!

Resources & People Mentioned

Connect with Shira Mor

Connect With Mark

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